the golf bag story
#1
from Steve Thomas' deposition - -  how myths get going

Thomas depo 34 - golf bag story"
 
  
Well, here it is - the "source" for the BORG myth (John denies he ever asked after his golf clubs and no one has stepped forward to testify against him - - and now we get to hear the story started when...
Q. Page 48, the first full paragraph. "John was overheard to ask someone quietly, 'Did you get my
golf bag?'" Did I read that correctly?

A. Yes.
Q. Who overheard him ask that question?
A. I believe that was either John or Barbara Fernie.
Q. Who did they overhear him ask that question to? Who was the someone?
A. They could not identify that party.
Q. And when did that statement, was it allegedly made?
A. The did you get my golf bag statement?
Q. Yeah.
A. I think in the days following the murder.
Q. Do you know how many days after the murder?
A. No.




... some days after the murder someone (either John or Barbara, Thomas isn't sure) was not being spoken to but overheard a conversation to someone who they can't identify and they heard John asking after his golf clubs.
That sure doesn't sound like documented fact to me - not at all.
Reply
#2
2000-04-11: “JonBenet, Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation”
by Steve Thomas and Don Davis, April 11, 2000

From Steve Thomas' book - JonBenet - Page 48

"That evening, John Ramsey went to Crist Mortuary to discuss funeral arrangements. In addition to the usual rites, transportation was needed for burial in Atlanta.

Patsy awoke while he was gone and staggered from the bedroom to a couch, barely able to speak, and told her sisters she needed some things from Fifteenth Street. John was overheard to ask someone quietly, "Did you get my golf bag?" When I learned of that statement, it seemed totally out of order. There had been two golf bags in the house, but he had not specified which one he wanted. Neither bag was collected by police. Moreover, it was winter in Colorado, Michigan, and Georgia, not exactly optimal golfing conditions. Why would a man whose daughter had just been murdered be wanting his golf clubs anyway? I wondered what else might have been in the bag that was so important that Ramsey would even think to ask about it."

(SNIP)

ST Page 324

"Smit slowly leafed through notebooks filled with evidence pictures, asking Ramsey if he noticed anything different, unusual, or out of place. The common theme was that plenty of things were strange. A box of tissues did not belong there, a pillow missing here, dust and dirt disturbed elsewhere. To Ramsey it looked as though the Tupperware container in JonBenet's bedroom had something in it (the same thing Lou Smit believed). Ramsey's testimony seemed very well rehearsed. Ramsey almost seemed to know the answers before the questions were asked. A cigar box was out of place, as was his golf bag. He pointed out marks on a keyhole and noted that an Easter basket had been moved."
Reply
#3
My note - - Georgia has winter - Georgia is a southern state where people golf year-round.

Thomas' book is Biased, BORG and disgracefull.
Reply
#4
Patsy Ramsey Interrogation by Thomas Haney and Trip DeMuth - Present also were Patrick Burke and Ellis Armistead June 23, 24, 25, 1998 - Boulder, Colorado


0346
10 PATSY RAMSEY: This is the basement.
11 (Inaudible).
12 TOM HANEY: Because of that and the fact it
13 is little difficult to work around, if you can describe
14 the things that you can see from there.
15 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, JonBenet's Easter
16 basket. And this looks like a little wall. They had
17 taken off the wall in the living room where the
18 Christmas tree was at, and miscellaneous candles and
19 things, ribbons. This is the box where I started to
20 keep paper work from the kid's school projects. The
21 train area in there.
22 TOM HANEY: The boxes, the red one is on
23 file, it says that's crafts.
24 PATSY RAMSEY: Grapes.
25 TOM HANEY: Grapes?

0347
1 PATSY RAMSEY: Grapes. That is like grapes
2 that I put on the Christmas tree, like the artificial,
3 and that looks like a card table in five. There is a
4 sink sort of area here. And (inaudible). Golf clubs.
5 TOM HANEY: Whose are those?
6 PATSY RAMSEY: Those are John's.
7 TOM HANEY: Does he play much golf?
8 PATSY RAMSEY: No.
9 TOM HANEY: Do you remember the last time he
10 played?
11 PATSY RAMSEY: You mean recently here?
12 TOM HANEY: Well, no.
13 PATSY RAMSEY: No. I don't remember when.
14 TOM HANEY: Okay. Did you play?
15 PATSY RAMSEY: No. I got golf clubs, I think
16 maybe last Christmas hoping to. So far I have not.
17 TRIP DEMUTH: Patsy, there are two doors
18 there, were those normally open or closed?
19 PATSY RAMSEY: Those are normally open.
20 TRIP DEMUTH: What about this, what is this
21 brown --
22 PATSY RAMSEY: This is brown like a little
23 end table that came down from the living room. They
24 had to take a lot of furniture out of the living room
25 to get Christmas in there.

0348
1 TRIP DEMUTH: Does that look like where it
2 was left?
3 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah. It was all pretty much
4 thrown down there.
5 TRIP DEMUTH: Is that blocking the door to
6 the training room, do you remember?
7 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, I don't know if it was
8 fully blocking it, but it was a lot of stuff piled up
9 in that area right there.
.

June 1998 Patsy Ramsey Interrogation by Thomas Haney and Trip DeMuth (Golf Clubs and Golfing)

0348
10 TRIP DEMUTH: There is nothing unusual about
11 the location in this photo. It looks kind of where you
12 left it?
13 PATSY RAMSEY: I mean, I can't imagine I
14 would have put it right in front of there because they
15 had to go in there to play.
16 TRIP DEMUTH: I can't really tell by looking.
17 PATSY RAMSEY: I can't either.
18 TRIP DEMUTH: That is why I'm asking.
19 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

(SNIP)

0396
13 TOM HANEY: How about John, what did he get?
14 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, I made him a painting --
15 golf or whatever it is. He gave me a gold bracelet.

(SNIP)

0459
23 TOM HANEY: Okay. And you are looking at
24 three -- well, let's see, 73 it is not significant.
25 374 is a close up the golf clubs in the basement.

0460
1 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah.
2 TRIP DEMUTH: Whose are they?
3 PATSY RAMSEY: John's, I guess. I don't
4 know.
5 TOM HANEY: He wasn't an avid golfer?
6 PATSY RAMSEY: Not really. I think, I know
7 he had some Ping golf clubs. That is one of his bags,
8 too. So I don't know. I wasn't paying --

(SNIP)

0461
4 TOM HANEY: How about 375, just a close up
5 again, and 376.
6 PATSY RAMSEY: That looks like that might be
7 that little sink in the basement. Yeah, the sink in
8 the basement. I think that is the sink in the
9 basement, yeah.
10 TOM HANEY: Nothing out of the ordinary?
11 PATSY RAMSEY: No.
12 TOM HANEY: 381.
13 TRIP DEMUTH: Take this out.
14 PATSY RAMSEY: Junk drawer. (Inaudible).
15 Golf ball it looks like to me. Tape. (Inaudible),
16 maybe. Junk.
Reply
#5
John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane
Present also were Bryan Morgan, PI David Williams
June 23, 24, 25, 1998 - Boulder, Colorado


0275
8 LOU SMIT: Okay. This here is a photograph.
9 (INAUDIBLE) you golf clubs, okay? Now, you're a
10 golfer, I assume?
11 JOHN RAMSEY: I can claim that.
12 LOU SMIT: Now this is a -- just take a
13 look at this. This is actually a photograph of
14 golf clubs. It's located down near the wine cellar
15 in the basement. And I just wanted you to take a
16 look and see if you see anything in regards to
17 that that seems out of place, or maybe if any
18 clothes are missing there?
19 JOHN RAMSEY: No, I don't see anything that
20 looks odd. Looks like there's two woods in the
21 bag. I think I have three and I can't really tell
22 if there's three or not. There's a putter, eight
23 irons, seven or eight. (INAUDIBLE) I don't see,
24 no.
25 LOU SMIT: By the way, that's photograph

0276
1 number 374. And that photograph was taken during
2 the crime scene investigation after the search
3 warrant was obtained. So that was after.
4 Now I have photographs 72 and 71. And these are
5 photographs taken during what we can describe as
6 the kidnapping phase, when the crime scene techs
7 were there. And that's before the body was found.
8 And I wanted to show you this. This was taken
9 earlier that morning. And I want you to take a
10 look at these photos and do you see anything out
11 of place and anything which would draw your
12 attention, or if anything is missing that you can
13 remember?
.

June 1998 John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane (Golf Clubs and Golfing)

0276
14 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, it's obviously been
15 moved around some. This bag has been moved, looks
16 like.
17 MIKE KANE: Which one are you referring to?
18 JOHN RAMSEY: A purple bag with my name on
19 it.
20 MIKE KANE: From where to where?
21 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, it looks like it's been
22 moved down off the pile, because it's usually
23 here. This laundry basket doesn't show in here.
24 LOU SMIT: So it looks like something has
25 been moved between the time this picture was taken

0277
1 and this picture was taken?
2 JOHN RAMSEY: It looks like this cane
3 has been moved. It's hard to tell from the
4 picture. 5 LOU SMIT: (INAUDIBLE)
6 JOHN RAMSEY: It looks like those little
7 marks
8 are right on the heel in the back hallway.

(SNIP)

0642
20 MIKE KANE: Do you remember the day
21 after this happened, being on the phone talking
22 to someone about getting your golf clubs?
23 JOHN RAMSEY: No. Absolutely not.
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)